If reason and the scientific evidence showed that the Judeo-Christian God existed and was morally perfect, would you pursue a relationship with him to obtain salvation?
Here is what I mean by this. I was going to show how God is an omnipotent/ omnipresent/ omniscient /eternal /necessary/ personal/immaterial/ spaceless timeless cause who is the creator and sustainer of our Universe. However, my argument for omnibenevolence is a separate case that requires me to use the bible.
I was going to show how the Genesis account of the first three chapters is 100% consistent with scientific discovery. I was also going to argue that the Genesis account made scientifically accurate predictions that have been confirmed. Thus, we can conclude that Moses must have been divinely inspired by Yahweh because there is no way Moses (or even a group of unknown writers) could have known this much information about reality in a pre-scientific era without being wrong.
Why is all this important?
I am sure you would accept that Jesus Christ probably existed at least as a common man minus the extraordinary claims, but I know you don't believe the resurrection event happened even if it happened by Divine fiat. This is because its an extraordinary claim that requires extraordinary evidence, and I agree with objections from skeptics about how the Gospels by themselves would not suffice IF we assume it happened NATURALLY.
However, by providing scientific evidence for the Genesis account of Adam's story, it would not only show that the resurrection event could have happened, but we would expect it to happen based upon the concept of original sin within the Fall. This would allow me to make a stronger case for the resurrection event to confirm that God revealed himself through Jesus. As a result, it would provide evidence that God revealed himself through Yahweh and Jesus Christ . When you add in the fact that neither one violated the moral standards they set in place, we can conclude this being is omnibenevolent.
What does it mean to be omnibenevolent in theology and philosophy? All-just , all-loving, and all-good (i.e. morally perfect)
God the father (i.e. Yahweh) represents the all justness
God the son (i.e. Jesus) represents the all-loving.
How do you get saved?
The way in which you get saved is to accept there is only one God who revealed himself through the person of Jesus Christ, and accept that Jesus died for your sins and rose from the dead "supernaturally" . Lastly, you must accept that salvation is obtained through grace alone by repenting your sins to Christ. That's it. There are NO superstitious religious rituals you have to do to get saved and the focus would NOT simply be to abstain from sin but to be like Christ. In other words, Salvation is a FREE gift that everyone can have, BUT not everyone wants to have it, which is why I framed the question the way that I did. This is why Christianity is fundamentally NOT a religion but a relationship with God through Christ where God chooses you to be saved and reunite with him by accepting Christ not the other way around.
Saved from what?
Its salvation from yourself if you want the short answer. Here is the long answer. If you believe in Christ, you would not only enter into heaven but your sins committed on earth will be pardoned and your ability to sin and sinful nature going forward will be gone as well. However, If you reject Christ your entire life on earth, you would not only separate yourself from God forever but you will be punished for the sins committed on earth and be punished for any additional sin you commit in the afterlife, which you will repeatedly do BECAUSE you also retain the sinful nature. As a result, it becomes eternal punishment where you will be tortured by your own sins you committed on earth and in the afterlife that you did not repent of.
If Yahweh was moral then he would not kill when he can cure and he is shown to kill quite often in scriptures, even to the point of torturing a baby for 6 days before finally killing it.
If you can show the morality of his killing instead of curing then I think we can chat about other issues you have spoken to.
These moral men seem to have reach the right verdict.
https://vimeo.com/7038401
I recognize that morality is subjective while you might think it objective but use your own subjective reasoning and not objective dogma to reply please.
We did not get too far the last time we talked but I am always willing.
Regards
DL
Regards
DL
Meerkat SK5:
It seems to me that rather than addressing the title of your own post, you've chosen to proselytize what you believe and tell us what will happen after we die according to your belief. You've gone on to talk about how we need to be saved.
My actual interest in this is all in the heading. Since you seem to be keen on the idea of God according to Christianity, I can give a firm and resounding "no," to the question at hand. If God were real, he would be a being that punishes infinitely for finite crimes, and if he is indeed both omnipotent and omniscient, he would be capable of knowing exactly what we were going to do that was wrong and either stopping those things from happening or forgive us in advance, without the aid of blood sacrifice (something that even humans are capable of, I might add).
I genuinely hope you'll come back and address the actual question being posed here, or at least give me a reason to think that God as described in the Bible ISN'T a moral thug.
